Article Link NPR (2022): "Want to get stronger? Try weightlifting" [content about body image]

[hch]

The thread "NPR: "Millions of women are 'under-muscled.'" [sarcopenia-related links]" (most of all cataddict's recent post mentioning "bulky") got me to search for earlier NPR content with the word "bulk" and its derivatives in the context of body image. And I actually found something!

"Want to get stronger? Try weightlifting" (2022) has some parts that especially interest me about how we think about fitness, bodies, and that sort of thing.

It also contains a practical emphasis, though it mainly points to other resources (and it's probably for the best that the speakers didn't attempt to squeeze detailed form instruction into this piece). This emphasis is more for a gym context and doesn't really cover specific training material that'd be new to most VFers (for example, the piece explains the difference between "sets" and "reps").

I plan to start a set of later posts for those interesting points; quoting (or paraphrasing) and commenting on every "interesting" part in one post would be very long.

[hch]

The host, Alex Sujong Laughlin:

Fitness is a big part of my life. I played sports growing up, like soccer, cross-country and swimming. I like sweating, and I liked the physical challenge that sports offered me. But I was also a teenage girl in America with a subscription to a teen magazine that delivered workouts each month that promised to tone my tummy and slim my arms all without bulking me up. Strength training would only give me bulbous, unfeminine muscles, so I stuck with cardio. I ran miles and miles and took, like, a million spin classes. Strength training was OK as long as you did lots of reps with light weights. Yoga and Pilates were a yes because they promised slim muscle definition. Powerlifting was a hard no.

Fast-forward to now. I'm in my late 20s, and running is harder than it used to be. I' m more injury-prone, and I've hurt my back and knees when I tried to get my mileage up. One of the main pieces of advice I've gotten to prevent injury - more strength training.

I have no experience reading teen magazines (even from when I was a teen), and I don't see exact years for when she was reading those magazines, but she would've been in her early teens around 2010. Not very long ago, I was looking manually through old threads in VF's General Discussion for something that happened to be from around that time. Although I wasn't surprised by what I noticed along the way, I was struck by how much more preoccupied VF discussion was about things like weight, size, and aesthetics. What the host describes reading in those magazines is remarkably similar to what VFers were reading, discussing, and even promoting--and I'm not surprised that what girls were hearing wasn't much different (or much better).

(I did also notice the contrast with how VF is now; I don't know how the change happened, but it's really possible, and arguably more healthful, to use other ways to think about fitness.)

These mentions also remind me of a similar discussion, which I may continue later, is about how weirdly gendered the fitness world can be--as in how yoga and especially Pilates have tended to be promoted. Yes, I'll mention again how my first exposures to Pilates, over 20 years ago, seemed to treat it as a means towards Some Long Lean Body. Although at least the language didn't make Pilates sound "unmasculine," it also didn't give any distinct and functional reasons that someone without any interest in the physique might try it. The VF community was actually the first place where I heard otherwise, and I'll always have VFers to thank.

[hch]

The host speaks to a few others, first to a Poorna Bell:

BELL: I didn't really and I had never really prioritized getting physically strong. The language that we use to talk about our own bodies and how we relate to physical activity and the classic one being oh, I've got to - equating fitness or movement to working off something that you've eaten is such a big one for me. And so that ends up being the dominant narrative, not I might want to lift some weights 'cause that will help me to, like, carry my luggage or a dustbin or something else.

I've basically agreed for some time about this framing; my thoughts here affect a lot of things, like what instructors I want to follow. The intention shapes the product ("forms follows function," I guess).

I also found it interesting that in recent years, "working off something you've eaten" (especially in its more extreme forms) has been identified as problematic.

LAUGHLIN: And that brings us to our first takeaway, which I admit is a tough one - start by reestablishing your exercise goals. Working out isn't for weight loss only, but establishing this healthy mindset is much easier said than done.

BELL: My goal with this is literally getting people to unlearn what they think that they know about fitness and to then rebuild it in a way that suits them best.

LAUGHLIN: And I want to be clear here. This is something you could spend your whole life working on. The world we live in is saturated with messaging that certain kinds of bodies are more attractive, healthier or worth more. That fear of mine that strength training would make me bulky - turns out, it's pretty common among women. And no surprise - it's also rooted in sexism. It comes from this idea that women should be smaller than men, that strength is unladylike or unfeminine, which is pretty messed up when you think about it. And that fear has direct impacts on who tries to get strong and who doesn't. A 2019 Penn State study found that women were significantly less likely to participate in strength-building activities than their male peers.

I'm reminded of my observation from years ago that, at the time, there were only a few remaining spheres of interest where labeling women as "unfeminine" was still somewhat acceptable. The fitness world, I hope, is becoming less of one.

[Gemini2874]

Thank you for a lovely read and for your additional “food for thought” points. You always bring an interesting perspective to the table and I appreciate your thoughtful and articulate reflections. I so very much enjoy reading your posts. This article made me think of an American power lifter I follow who is very inspiring. She has even beaten men! Her name is Gabi Dixson. Here is a short clip of her breaking another record: https://youtu.be/ZFovXyEchrs?si=y21bhztUxXoCKUOD

Gabi Stats from Giants Live:

Competition Lifts

Deadlift: 263kg/580lb
Log Lift: 107kg/235lb
Car Walk: 317.5kg/700lb
Farmer’s Walk: 142.5kg/315lb
Personal best training lifts: 340lb stone

Powerlifting

Squat: 235kg/518lb
Bench: 117.5kg/259lb
Deadlift: 260kg/573lb
Total: 610kg/1345lb

[prettyinpink]

What is presented to women as aesthetically appealing changes over time, and is more about what big players in media show and women themselves aspire to and compare themselves with, than what men find appealing.
Just in the 20th century there have been shifts every decade or two. So some of the acceptance of a more muscular body could just be one of those shifts. As to all the factors that influence these shifts, there are probably many. It’s less that there’s new information, than in who has louder voices, in what information is being presented, and how. Better access to and greater influence of strength and conditioning fitness pros on social media may have been a factor.

But it is a definite change. Thinking about when Terminator 2 with Linda Hamilton or GI Jane with Demi Moore came out, and how it was so unusual or radical to see a woman with arms that had some muscles. And it was cool, but still not something the vast majority of women would have wanted to look like. Today, though, having visible muscle is much more normal and desirable.
And I’m going to go ahead and say it, having bigger glutes has also been a thing for a few years now, and weights are the way to get them.

When we consider what “bulky” means, it’s widely accepted now that women becoming huge from lifting weights is a myth. But it is true that lifting heavy weights over time can make one look more muscular, and some women still aren't going to like that look for themselves, for whatever reason.
Thank goodness there is less rhetoric in the fitness world today about “long lean muscles” or becoming tinier, than there was even 10-15 years ago.

That brings me to why things seem to have changed at VF. Not only have the messages changed, but VF posters have gotten older. It’s not that we don’t care about weight or appearance, but as a whole, I think we probably care a lot more about healthy aging than those other things.

[toaster]

Originally Posted by hch

I have no experience reading teen magazines (even from when I was a teen), and I don't see exact years for when she was reading those magazines, but she would've been in her early teens around 2010. Not very long ago, I was looking manually through old threads in VF's General Discussion for something that happened to be from around that time. Although I wasn't surprised by what I noticed along the way, I was struck by how much more preoccupied VF discussion was about things like weight, size, and aesthetics. What the host describes reading in those magazines is remarkably similar to what VFers were reading, discussing, and even promoting--and I'm not surprised that what girls were hearing wasn't much different (or much better).

(I did also notice the contrast with how VF is now; I don't know how the change happened, but it's really possible, and arguably more healthful, to use other ways to think about fitness.)

I think there has been a positive change on VF. I'll share one theory.

I'm someone who was exposed to teen magazines - many! In the 1980s, I had a subscription to Seventeen for years and to Glamour for years after that. In the 1990s, when I got more into fitness, I had a subscription to Shape (or whatever the woman's version was) at one point.

Woman from my era was completely indoctrinated in beauty, esthetics, weight, dieting, etc. The same may very well be true for the younger generation, but back then, there wasn't even any countervailing information - e.g., the problems with "diet culture," body positivity, women can be strong, etc. We had Jane Fonda in gym class and that is it!

So to my theory - VF is aging. Many of us are now in our 50s, 60s, and beyond. I think we are finally getting to a "to hell with all of that age" and are exercising to live strong, healthy lives.

Or so I hope.

[cataddict]

So interesting!

toaster, you make a valid point that there really wasn’t a “counterbalance” of information against the rail thin aesthetic that prevailed as the desired look. I would love to know what the attitude is of younger generations of women—not meaning just the current fad of big butts (yeah, muscle training gets some of that, but nope, genetics has a large role and a big butt wasn’t in my past or future).

prettyinpink, yes, on the influence of media shaping our views of what is an “ideal” body! Of course the “ideal” discussed almost exclusively applies to women, as sexism is always a factor.

I did get Seventeen mag in my teens but I don’t know that it in particular influenced my feelings about my body. I was a heavy child for roughly 6 years at a critical part of childhood, and the treatment I received from other children probably was a larger factor than either my family (who were non judgmental) or magazines.

I have seen my personal attitude about strength/weight training evolve, albeit slowly, over the years. As others have said, as we get older we see the benefits in living our daily lives. I watched my parents’ generation of women get weaker and more fragile as the little musculature they had atrophied with age. I do feel fortunate that my own mother was naturally muscular and those genes apparently passed to me. She did get weaker, but not to the extent that her friends did. I expect that some women might see me as “bulkier” than they would want for themselves, but I see my “bulk” as muscle and it’s positive.

[cataddict]

Gemini, thanks for sharing that info about Gabi Dixson! She is so impressive!

[hch]

Thanks for the replies! These two next posts should be the first of multiple replies to everyone who's posted to far.

Originally Posted by prettyinpink

What is presented to women as aesthetically appealing changes over time, and is more about what big players in media show and women themselves aspire to and compare themselves with, than what men find appealing.
Just in the 20th century there have been shifts every decade or two. So some of the acceptance of a more muscular body could just be one of those shifts. As to all the factors that influence these shifts, there are probably many. It’s less that there’s new information, than in who has louder voices, in what information is being presented, and how. Better access to and greater influence of strength and conditioning fitness pros on social media may have been a factor.

I do agree that such changes are part of the overall conversation, but I also noticed how (somewhat quietly) anti-aesthetic the piece is. (No one there proposes replacing an anti-muscle aesthetic with a "pro-muscle" aesthetic.) The host talks about new patterns of thinking as "something you could spend your whole life working on." I can find 20 minutes on that part (yet another potential companion piece?) interesting and valuable.

[hch]

Originally Posted by prettyinpink

That brings me to why things seem to have changed at VF. Not only have the messages changed, but VF posters have gotten older. It’s not that we don’t care about weight or appearance, but as a whole, I think we probably care a lot more about healthy aging than those other things.

I've actually thought about related things before and have thought about possible links between an "aging" VF and the change in posts over the years. I have five thoughts, though some are more speculative than others:

(1) VF seems to be generally less "controversial" and fractious. (This change is probably due to other reasons as well.)

Originally Posted by toaster

So to my theory - VF is aging. Many of us are now in our 50s, 60s, and beyond. I think we are finally getting to a "to hell with all of that age" and are exercising to live strong, healthy lives.

Or so I hope.

(2) People seem less generally interested in doing rather rigorous things to try to attain relatively specific 'visible results." I may even have seen some people say things like "as I get older, the less interested I am in getting this particular physique."

(3) Also, older VFers seem generally more interested in, for example, being able to use the toilet by ourselves than in worrying over how "big" our thighs are.

(4) As we age, we probably find building muscle harder anyway. Even people with unreconstructed anti-"bulk" biases are probably less likely to reach a point where their appearances become "unfeminine." (An instructor who became infamous beyond the fitness world for her remarks on women's physiques is now promoting a product that supposedly fights "age-related muscle loss." Finally, here's a muscle loss that she doesn't embrace! )

(5) Some people aren't willing to change, but they won't be posting forever anyway. A less morbid-sounding related thing is one specific reason that I'd like to see new members on VF: presumably younger members, overall less influenced by "women's muscle BAD" thinking, would help change things even faster.

There are also wider changes in science and culture. For example, although I would hardly accept this explanation as a "full" excuse for what people were saying years ago, certain ideas were easier to entertain when people thought of cardio,cardio,cardio as The Only Important Exercise or thought of muscle primarily as a "calorie burner" and a "body shaper."