Zone 2 cardio, women, and Stacy Sims

[prettyinpink]

So Stacy Sims seems to be just about everywhere in the past couple of years, in the podcast and social media world the algorithms show me, at least

Here’s a short form example of what she says about peri- and post-menopausal women and cardio. https://www.drstacysims.com/blog/wha...one-2-training

In some interviews I’ve seen, she recommends a couple specific HIIT protocols, and states that intervals need to be very very hard and short (like in the original HIIT definitions), not the 45 minute cardio workouts that are titled “HIIT.”

She says we need this rather than a lot of zone 2 cardio.

The thing is, I don’t hear anyone else saying this. Have other VFer’s? In the blog post above, she mentions research on differences in muscle fibers between men and women, but I haven’t heard her cite any research in outcomes in real women (or women vs. men) doing different sorts of cardio and different sorts of HIIT. Maybe I’ve missed it?

Is that because there is none, and she is taking these couple of ideas about muscle from basic science and making guesses from there— meaning they are just her own opinions about what older women should do? Or in fact have women been studied in trials considering different levels of cardio, and in actuality don’t have significant differences, and this is just her way of distinguishing herself and making a brand? She also said a few things I never heard anyone else say about women and fasted exercise, but since I don’t do that I didn’t think too much about it.

I think she says a lot of interesting things and says a lot of things I’ve heard elsewhere. I’m just curious about this cardio thing. I note she is developing an exercise program with someone else, which I will be interested in as it is supposed to involve power training and HIIT. But, I’m also wondering about these cardio claims.

Now that the search function works here again, yay!, I saw there were some here who read her book(s), so I’d love to hear any reviews or any comments about whether her book addresses anything more about cardio. Or if you’ve heard others who say this same thing and more or less agree with her, I’d like to hear about that, too.

[alisoncooks]

I’ve seen some of the threads that mention this, but I’m choosing to ignore it. I gained weight when I tried this approach recently. I switched back to LISS and the extra pounds dropped right off. I think maybe it works for some bodies, and for some (me) it just increases the cortisol too much (or at least that’s what I’m telling myself).

[FirmDancer]

I have a free subscription to Les Mills On Demand. I used to belong to a Facebook group that follows Stacy's book Next Level and uses Les Mills for their workouts. It's very popular, lots of discussion. Some people are seeing great results. I don't keep up with it for the most part. My aging body (I'm 67) does not like lifting really heavy. And I had to drill down how much protein I was consuming if I followed her math.
-Neita

[TracyQ]

Dr. Rhonda Patrick talks a lot about how important HIIT is but I don’t recall her talking about it specifically for menopause/peri menopause.

The clip I posted showed up in my feed today. I thought it was so interesting. They talk about heart benefits here but I’ve also heard her talk about high intensity workouts for brain health which is what I’m really interested in lately.

I’m trying to make my 60 year old self like HIIT workouts again like I used to when I was younger. I don’t hate them but it’s mentally difficult to work that hard. I do enjoy when I’m through and I get my stats from my Fitbit.

https://youtu.be/MjKrwsfr-js?si=xhozSquJNYL8ASrQ

[Leonana]

Interesting topic! I can’t do high impact, which makes HIIT harder to achieve for me. I guess I’d need an exercise bike or use a step.

I searched but it was hard to find any info other than Stacy Sims. I found one that said women get better results with a shorter recovery time when doing HIIT.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7000457/

This article from a fitness company claims that HIIT doesn’t work well for weight loss for women over 40, or at least their clients. It makes too much cortisol.

https://trinitytransformation.co.uk/...women-over-40/

Everything I found on LISS is pretty general, good for everyone.

[Leonana]

Okay, I found this article. 30 second HIIT can give women hormonal benefits. But no more than two to three times a week. Otherwise, without a recovery period, cortisol becomes an issue.

https://www.puregym.com/blog/the-bes...uts-for-women/

Now this study seems to show the opposite. It’s from 2018.

“Evidence suggests that females and males respond differently to the type of PA they undertake: females appear to gain greater benefit from low to moderate aerobic exercise, whereas males may acquire greater health status through more intense activity. “

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6230216/

[donnamp]

This is all so interesting - all the different findings and some of them contradictory!

My personal feeling is everyone is different and responds differently to different things. Yes, I suppose there are some 'general rules' that apply to everyone but when it comes to fitness I do think there is a good degree of variability in what works best for each person

I think you also have to take into account what you enjoy doing and what feels good for your body - forcing yourself to do something you don't enjoy or which causes injury or pain is not going to be successful in the long run

One thing in the article I did agree with was that HIIT and Zone 2 cardio are probably not being used as intended. The 45 min HIIT workouts that are out there on DVD or You Tube are probably not the HIIT workouts that are studied (which are supposed to be very intense - so intense that you couldn't do it for 45 min!) and I think some people "over do" the Zone 2 cardio - making it harder than what it is intended to be -and therefore do not reap the benefits it is intended to provide.

Donna

[sherry7899]

Donna , I agree with you. While I love Team Body Project, the workouts they label.as HIIT are definitely not "real" HIIT. I think the last true HIIT workouts I remember doing are Turbo Fire. I have shoulder and back issues, so I don't really do HIIT anymore. I am worried about injuring myself.

I adore hour long dance workouts. I stick with them because I have fun doing them. I don't want to do exercise I hate.I do some exercise I don't enjoy as much, but I don't do anything I don't enjoy at all.

[Vintage VFer]

I've never heard of Stacy Sims.

It seems to be a trend to use the words pre- and post-menopausal as buzzwords.

Tony Horton (of all people) teamed up with some other female "expert" (that I'd never heard of either) to do workouts for specific days of a menstrual cycle.

The PERFECT WORKOUT PLAN | PowerSync 60™ Program with Tony Horton and Dr. Mindy Pelz

Sorry to be so jaded, I've seen a lot of trends come and go. Of course, I'm waaay past menopause.

[prettyinpink]

I’m so happy to see all the replies. Some good thoughts here.

VintageVFer, I think they are used as buzzwords sometimes. Jaded, I don’t know, wisdom can look like jaded to the inexperienced. It is a thing that women go through, but yes, there is a huge market of women with vague symptoms which may or may not be due to hormone changes, for getting attached to certain practitioners for hormone creams, supplements, or whatever the latest thing is, and that includes fitness. It certainly makes you wonder when they started talking about perimenopause and menopause as something starting in our 30’s through the rest of our lives, in some sense medicalizing normal life.

And for years we were told that we needed to work out differently, but in a more wimpy way than the guys! This is again a different way that we are supposed to work out, but not so wimpy. But is it real?

On the other hand, women are different than men in some ways, and I’m glad we are learning more about that. I just don’t know that we do know that we are radically different when it comes to fitness.
Since fitness is a hobby for many of us, it makes sense to be interested in the small tweaks, though. If there are any!